Thanks Ed, very well said about the "holy" land. I am however not only skeptical but quite cynical that the sun rises and sets. It does not. We experience sunrive and sunleve at near a thousand miles per hour. Cheers.
Ah, Andre R, a man with knowledge--a sure source of evil doubting. Seriously, you're right, of course--and, I'm nearly sure, not serious about arguing with anyone over sunsets and sunrises.
It sounds like we have similar views on Hamas' terrorism and Israel's response. I care for both Israelis (including the 2+ million Palestinian Israeli citizens) and innocent people in Gaza. Hamas is a terrorist organization, does not act in the best interests of Palestinians, and uses Gazans as human shields. Hamas purposely attacked innocent Israelis. I wish the Israel military could wipe Hamas out completely without innocent people being killed.
Jews are getting it from the left and the right. I have an Israeli friend who is a professor at UMD, where his daughter is a freshman. He believes she is not safe on campus because of the violent rhetoric of so-called pro-Palestinian student groups. My friend pointed me to this NYT article. One of several statements that stuck out to me is, "That message [referencing Bernie Sander's statement] is undermined when a loud part of the left insists that when it comes to Israelis, there is no such thing as civilians." This view seems to be widespread. This is terrifying to progressive Jews, including atheist-Jews. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/12/opinion/columnists/israel-gaza-massacre-left.html?fbclid=IwAR1LRFq1fdEyBwls4axHsoaGdmBjZBjJA8AMLypsSs9nWDMg-_xUhfWuyB0
Also, as much as I respect President Carter, I wish he hadn't identified Israel as an apartheid state in the title. The label is disturbing and could incite violence. I realize the book was published years ago, and I don't know what his current views are.
I really do need to read Carter's book before displaying it. We are in pretty close to complete agreement, Jodi, including complete disgust at your friend's daughter having to harbor any such fears. I'm veering more away from "leftism" than I thought possible.
I haven't read Carter's book either. I imagine he presents his specific arguments in the book. But, I can't imagine he'd be able to change my mind about this particular point about Israel.
I still refer to myself as liberal (left on many issues and more moderate on others) in large part because "progressive" has too much baggage. Most of the baggage is fabricated by the right, but as we've seen lately, some of it is deserved.
I am "skeptical" of claims that appear to me to be to some extent plausible but groundless, such as the claim that my Viking ancestors penetrated to the upper Midwest long before Lake Wobegon. I am "cynical" of claims that have been so thoroughly discredited that they cannot be held honestly or except under the influence of ideological infatuations. Creationism would be an example. I do not debate creationism. Been there. Done that. I simply refer to the dozens of books and hundreds of articles that have dismantled creationism piece by piece.
Thanks Ed, very well said about the "holy" land. I am however not only skeptical but quite cynical that the sun rises and sets. It does not. We experience sunrive and sunleve at near a thousand miles per hour. Cheers.
Ah, Andre R, a man with knowledge--a sure source of evil doubting. Seriously, you're right, of course--and, I'm nearly sure, not serious about arguing with anyone over sunsets and sunrises.
It sounds like we have similar views on Hamas' terrorism and Israel's response. I care for both Israelis (including the 2+ million Palestinian Israeli citizens) and innocent people in Gaza. Hamas is a terrorist organization, does not act in the best interests of Palestinians, and uses Gazans as human shields. Hamas purposely attacked innocent Israelis. I wish the Israel military could wipe Hamas out completely without innocent people being killed.
Jews are getting it from the left and the right. I have an Israeli friend who is a professor at UMD, where his daughter is a freshman. He believes she is not safe on campus because of the violent rhetoric of so-called pro-Palestinian student groups. My friend pointed me to this NYT article. One of several statements that stuck out to me is, "That message [referencing Bernie Sander's statement] is undermined when a loud part of the left insists that when it comes to Israelis, there is no such thing as civilians." This view seems to be widespread. This is terrifying to progressive Jews, including atheist-Jews. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/12/opinion/columnists/israel-gaza-massacre-left.html?fbclid=IwAR1LRFq1fdEyBwls4axHsoaGdmBjZBjJA8AMLypsSs9nWDMg-_xUhfWuyB0
Also, as much as I respect President Carter, I wish he hadn't identified Israel as an apartheid state in the title. The label is disturbing and could incite violence. I realize the book was published years ago, and I don't know what his current views are.
I really do need to read Carter's book before displaying it. We are in pretty close to complete agreement, Jodi, including complete disgust at your friend's daughter having to harbor any such fears. I'm veering more away from "leftism" than I thought possible.
I haven't read Carter's book either. I imagine he presents his specific arguments in the book. But, I can't imagine he'd be able to change my mind about this particular point about Israel.
I still refer to myself as liberal (left on many issues and more moderate on others) in large part because "progressive" has too much baggage. Most of the baggage is fabricated by the right, but as we've seen lately, some of it is deserved.
I am "skeptical" of claims that appear to me to be to some extent plausible but groundless, such as the claim that my Viking ancestors penetrated to the upper Midwest long before Lake Wobegon. I am "cynical" of claims that have been so thoroughly discredited that they cannot be held honestly or except under the influence of ideological infatuations. Creationism would be an example. I do not debate creationism. Been there. Done that. I simply refer to the dozens of books and hundreds of articles that have dismantled creationism piece by piece.
Okay, so long as you don't mean Cynic with a capital "C," because that's something very different: https://figsinwinter.substack.com/p/how-to-say-no-with-diogenes-and-the